Yesterday I got a phone call.. The caller ID said it was my boyfriends number, but when I answered it it was a strange voice who introduced herself as the medical examiner… Brain hemorrhage and my life is shattered. People who love me and mean well keep telling me to “Find strength in God.”… “He’s in a better place”… “You’ll be with him again someday.”

As much as I want to.. I don’t feel the loving arms of the God that I’ve tried so hard to have faith in.. I really wish I did. I want to.. But I just can’t believe anymore.

I find it interesting, understandable, and very unfortunate that you associate the church with the Pharisees and the religious institutions of Jesus’ day. Surely one would expect the religion based on Jesus’ life, ministry and teaching and named after him to, at the very least, heed the criticisms he had of the religious people of his time? Jesus really shook things up and made waves in his society and the church is suppose to be the realization of those shake ups. Yet the criticisms of the Pharisees still seem incredibly relevant and Jesus’ message seems just as revolutionary.

My hope would be that people like yourself would read the gospels and associate Jesus and his disciples with the Church more than the Pharisees and the corruption in the Temple. That’s how Jesus decided to do it: him and twelve close friends, hanging out, learning, fishing, eating together and bringing the world some good news. Of course things get a little more complicated once Jesus heads back home but the New Testament is full of glimpses of the Church looking very little like the Pharisees.

NT Wright has a vision of the Church which I quite like:
“For many, “church” means just the opposite of that negative image. It’s a place of welcome and laughter, of healing and hope, of friends and family and justice and new life. It’s where the homeless drop in for a bowl of soup and the elderly stop by for a chat. It’s where one group is working to help drug addicts and another is campaigning for global justice. It’s where you’ll find people learning to pray, coming to faith, struggling with temptation, finding new purpose, and getting in touch with a new power to carry that purpose out. It’s where people bring their own small faith and discover, in getting together with others to worship the one true God, that the whole becomes greater than the sum of its parts. No church is like this all the time. But a remarkable number of churches are partly like that for quite a lot of the time.” – Simply Christian
Personally I feel blessed to be part of a Church that does look like that sometimes. But, like you basically said, if there is one thing worse than trying to sell Jesus it’s trying to sell your church.

My perception is that the path you are trying to take is: unclear belief in God -> a church (or mosque, synagogue etc.) -> nice clear idea of God. I think this is looking to the church for something it just isn’t capable of providing, even at its best. I would say the next step, at least on the Christian path, is Jesus: working out what you think of the accounts of his life, who he was and what his relationship with God was, what he said and what he challenges us to do. For me that gives me a better idea of who God is. Jesus then leads us to the Holy Spirit who gives us the grace, patience and motivation to try and put up with the Church. Now I don’t think this is something you have to necessarily do alone in a, “Come back when you agree with us” kind of way, instead perhaps you could include others in the journey. Talk to people who claim to have a clearer idea of who God is and work out where that idea comes from and why. The disciples were mostly fishermen who hung around a lot with a guy who claimed to have a clearer idea who God was and it seemed to work for them. Unfortunately you don’t have Jesus around but

As to the question of denominations: well I’ve waded in a little and I know a bit about the differences and where they come from so I can attempt to answer any questions. As to how it relates to you, well I guess the number of denominations should say that being a Christian doesn’t mean believing everything the guy next to you believes, but mostly they are just a distraction.

Anyway, I really enjoyed your post. Struggling to write the truth of where you actually are and how you actually feel is far superior to writing to try and engage people (and ironically more engaging) and I think the same principle can be applied to all “entertainment” included films, music (particularly Christian) and maybe even Churches.

I guess in general I think if someone is looking and honestly searching for God, God isn’t threatened by how or where someone looks. I think God respects people who really search to know Him. I actually suggested to Simon at one point to maybe try a synagogue or mosque first… it might be easier for him. To answer the above question, if he felt incredible fear about entering a mosque- I would probably first conclude that it was his own fears and not God leading him away. I think these are all things he needs to do and I don’t believe God shies away from the process that someone needs to go through to come to know Him.
To be clear, I will say that it is of course possible that God was leading him away from that particular church, but I think that would have more to do with maybe that particular church being hurtful than God leading him away from looking into the church as a whole… which is more what I picked up from the tone in your comments- but please correct me if I’m wrong.

Ha, So Simon thanks for allowing conversations like this to occur on your blog… as we somewhat analyze your situation and God’s designs on it… :-/ (something to think more about later…). Definitely appreciate your willingness to be open here.

Some people might tell you it’s a place where Christians go to worship, but that’s not correct because the Christian life itself is supposed to be an ongoing act of worship everyday in everything. You hit that nail on the nail on the head when you wrote about ‘representing.’

Maybe FreeThinker and Rachel are both onto something when they suggest that a [big] church isn’t for you. Jesus said, ‘Where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I in their midst.” So maybe you should ask God to help you find one of those people who is out there, as you put it, “representing.”

I hope Simon won’t mind me changing the scene of this post a little when I ask you this. Imagine that he had experienced the very same feelings outside of a mosque that he was about to walk into. Do you suppose in that case God might be speaking to Simon?

Freethinker, I think one thing I disagree with in your response is this idea of God leading him to not enter the church less he be confused by the instructions of man. Its possible God lead him to not enter the church, but I disagree with this on principle- I don’t believe that God would limit him in searching things out if he’s searching for the truth. I think that if someone is genuinely searching for God, then the teachings of man aren’t a threat to that search. I believe in one truth, and wherever that is gleaned or held there is value- even if its in a church. So there’s my thoughts on that… would love to hear yours as well.

I know you question the idea of ’signs from God’ but could the fact that you felt so “utterly conflicted” and “embattled” actually be God speaking directly to your soul I wonder?

Forgive me for repeating what I have written before, but have you ever considered that the reason why you were uneasy about church is because your spirit knows that you won’t find anything there but more emptiness, confusion, and condemnation?

I commend your bravery at trying to go back to church, but Simon I think maybe you should try to listen closer to the messages that were being sent to you while you stood outside the door of that church. I am very happy that you didn’t venture inside because I believe if you had then your focus would have become confused and the message from God would have become muddled with the instructions of man.

I think your search for God is a great idea Simon, I really do, but I think you are confusing it with a search for religion. I would suggest that maybe God was speaking to you on Sunday, only you didn’t realize.

In all honesty despite the context of my experiences with Christians I am not sure I want to write a post about it, not least of all because I don’t want to carve the future out of the past.

I will say that I know many truly great people who happen to be Christians, people I count among my friends, people who also happen to be pastors, worship leaders, and the such. These people have provided a balance to my experience of religious people, and their influence has played a very big role in keeping me from simply abandoning any desire to seek God.

My good experiences with religious people far outweigh the bad ones. However, with my religious friends there is an element that is absent with those religious people I do not know, and that element is trust.

Thanks for the response. This helps me understand your perspective a little better. And don’t worry, I am not “irked” by the use of the word “religious”. As I said in my last comment, I am not offended by the word.

I am only asking for clarification because I want to understand a little better. My goodness, in many ways I welcome the label. For example, one place in the scripture, it reads that “pure and genuine religion in the sight of God the Father means caring for orphans and widows”. So for me, if we defined it by that standard, I’d welcome you calling me religious any day of the week.

You see, for me, the word’s meaning is only as legitimate as the context in which it’s used. Unless I am misunderstanding, the context in which you use the word is included with other interesting words; words like “intolerant”, “judgmental”, “impatient”, “arrogant know-it-all’s”, etc. This of course is why I said that you perplex me. Because if the religious are all people who have faith in a God then by default I’m included in the “intolerant, judgmental, impatient, arrogant know-it-all” group. Then I wonder to myself, “boy, i sure didn’t mean to leave that impression on my friend Simon when we hung out the last time” Do you see my conundrum?

Simon,

You have used experience with “some christians” in “some churches” to define your entire experience. But it’s hard to swallow (as someone who knows you a little bit) because I know that you have had far more experiences with church people (religious people) then what you have represented in your post. That of course is your prerogative as the author and creator of a blog I suppose, but let me ask you a question. If you are genuinely searching for God and using “church people” as a reflection of who God might or might not be then shouldn’t you share the entire experience? Again, let me be clear, I’m not writing this because I feel offended. I am writing this because I want to challenge some of the presumptions being made here. I challenge the presumptions because I think that they may prevent you from finding the faith that have said you are seeking. I think that if you start choosing to see a distinction between the people that you think are legitimately more like Jesus and those that are not then you will be better for it and may even find what your looking for. I know that some church people have offended you. Others have not. Make a distinction between the two and search out the God of the ones that you think best fits the scriptures you are quoting.

I hope this helps and I truly want the best for you Simon!

Shane

Definitions of the word ‘Religious’ on the Web:
* concerned with sacred matters or religion or the church; “religious texts”; “a member of a religious order”
* having or showing belief in and reverence for a deity; “a religious man”; “religious attitude”
* of or relating to clergy bound by monastic vows; “the religious or regular clergy conducts the service”
* scrupulously faithful; conscientious: religious care.
* pertaining to or connected with a monastic or religious order.

However, I do understand that the word has an air of negativity to it, and I guess that to some extent I may have been using the word to make a point. If you don’t like the word religious then ask yourself why. Now apply that to someone outside of your religious community and imagine how they must feel.

I will add that I am NOT trying to insult anyone here. I deeply admire, to the point of envy, those who have a real and meaningful faith in God.